IMetal roofing underlaymets

Carlise WIP300 vs. Grace HT vs. OwnensCorning Weatherloock Special Tile & Metal

Any failures?

We usually use a SBS SA underlayment our preference is Polyglass a little more expensive but worth the well worth the price. Min hole penetration on the dry in.

i just did a metal roof.and just used 30 pound.and vented the ridge.you don't need high tech underlayment.

OS/Wywoody...Some good stuff....

The 'sap' story is my understanding, as well....and yes, the advent of solid sheathing had a detrimental effect on shakes.

The reactionary disposision of gov't agencies affects us in all sorts of ways....We have a nearby county which requires I&W on the entire roof, no-matter what....Simply because the predominent workforce cannot install roofs without it and not have them leak!

"Felt beneath asphalt shingles was originally intended to be a divorcing layer, Seperating the asphalt shingles from the wood substrate." And if you were popping lines, you could do it over a crack.

'If you can't roof it, use I&W, then felt it with a few layers and at least keep the home dry until the warranty is over' is the 'Rule of the Day' for the last several years.

I never even consider subbing work to any person, or any company whose owner tells me "Our call backs dropped/slowed/stopped/decreased, or similar, when we started using I&W on everything."

Amen Robert.

92' is when I came across the underlayment dependency craze, here in Colorado....Local municipalities were requiring 30# over old comp when re-covering....The best one, was when I noticed an outfit installing I&W over old T-lok, then another layer of comp....O - M - G!....

When i started roofing in British Columbia in 1981 we did not felt any shingle roofs in, shingles applied over bare plywood done that way for years.Shakes got felt 18 in rolls,felt is just a temporary dry in for new construction or reroofing is not part of the roofing system if water gets to the nails they will rust away and eventualy leak.Ice and water shield and felt paper are additional sources of income for the manufactures,everything has been added to increase thier profit margins.Because the state of florida thinks covering a house in ice and water shield is a roof dont make it so.When thousands of nails penetrate the substrate it will not withstand longterm exposure to water it will leak! :woohoo:

Felt beneath asphalt shingles was originally intended to be a divorcing layer, Seperating the asphalt shingles from the wood substrate.

Contrary to popular belief; Not an intregal part of any water-shedding mechanism.

However, as we all know, (just take a look at our freedoms, gov't's role, etc.....), time & popular perception, takes a toll on realities....

TomB Said: Do you know what the actual purpose of felt under shingles is for?

Yup I know. It doesn't matter what anyone thinks or says, if you are in the business, you follow the manufacturers instructions. They are written on the shingle packages or you can go to the websites.

B) :) :) B) Deep Down In Florida Where The Sun Shines Damn Near Every Day

Do you know what the actual purpose of felt under shingles is for?

Underlayments have been around and used for over 100years The most common shingle underpayment in North America for the last 100 years has been 15 or 30 pound asphalt felt. These products have performed well when properly secured. Failures from one piece and plastic caps have led the insurance company's push for peel and stick. Miami Dade testing proved that the old nail and tin cap standard tested higher than most peel and stick products. This method has always been the standard. If your going to use underlayments do it the proper way. B) :) :) B) Deep Down In Florida Where The Sun Shines Damn Near Every Day

That's awesome tinner!!!!!.....and that's about the size of it.....might as well be the gospel.....

Underlay is OK till I get to it. If it's in the way, I cut it back.

Here's an article about underlay.

The execs at a major shingle manufacturer felt they needed to increase sales somehow. Memos were sent to all departments in search of ideas. Some months went by and a fellow in marketing wanted to present an idea. A couple, really. He met with the execs one day and said “Let’s sell felt. The only people in the market are Bird and JM.” The execs all spoke up and said their entire market share there was new construction! “Only builders buy the felt to keep their projects dry until the roofers come and install the shingles. The roofers are often installing our shingles without felt. And it can’t be used on a re roof. What the heck do we want to sell felt for? The only felt we need is the 12” rag for our shingles. There will never be a need or market for us there. It could open us up to some new liability! And it isn‘t used under tin! Follansbee will void their warranty if they find felt under tin. We can‘t sell it there. There isn’t a roof in the world that requires felt…. How are you planning on selling THAT?” Get out of here with that hair-brained scheme!” “Please! Just give me a minute and you’ll see the logic! Please!” “You have 10 minutes.” “Here’s the deal. Our 15 year shingles regularly last 17-22 years minimum. And our 5 year warranty never needs to be honored, right?” Nods, and “yeses” from the execs. ‘So?” “ We will need to market ourselves as a leader to be envied. Let’s offer a ’7 year’ warranty ’if’ installers use our felt under our shingles! It’s a win-win. The shingles will go the term with or without the felt, but we can open up a whole new market and give glossy brochures to dealers to hand to installers and it only costs us pennies. The installers will do our marketing for us! We’ll always be able to ‘prove’ installation error if any warranty issues ever occur anyway. We can’t lose….It‘s a win-win and we get a larger market share all around.” “Research is showing that anybody less than 50 year old gets caught up in the hype that glossy brochures, TV ads, and radio ads spout. Any glossy ads we print will be taken as gospel. And it’s real easy to brainwash people if we were to do TV ads. Ignorant people soak them up like sponges! Older people tend to take ads with a grain of salt and figure that if it‘s worth being on TV, it‘ll be announced during the news as a news item. They seem to know the difference.” “The established and older roofers will never fall for that line.., but we could give it a try for a limited period of time. It’s your job on the line though!” “No problem Boss. We’ve been looking hard into this and we believe some hard pressed companies will use the ploy to increase their sales. And the newcomers to the roofing industry won’t know any better anyway. We won’t tool up for this, we’ll order from other makers and have our names stamped on the rolls. If this takes off, we’ll see about tooling up to make it ourselves, maybe. Who knows for sure. I do believe we can even make a market for it in the metal roofing side of things. Bill, Bob, myself a couple of others are looking into now.” “Joe and a small team are working on their own time to see if they can come up with some form of sticky felt. They heard a rumor that a company is working on a product that can be used on eaves to help with ice-dam issues. If it’s as good as rumor has it, even jacklegs will be able to do roofs with too many leaks further helping us avoid nay warranty issues. If it has merit, we we can come up with a marketing gimmick for it too.” “Just think ‘underlay’ and we’ll market the term and use it all the time until people start forgetting the roof itself and the underlay becomes the priority. Like I mentioned before, there is plenty up sell potential here and no liability beyond the pennies on the dollar we’re already liable for anyway. How can we lose?” “OK, we’ll also have legal look into all facets before anything goes public! One slip and you’re fired!” “Remember, this will have nothing to do with roof performance, it’s all about marketing! ”The New buzzword will be ‘Underlay!’ We will be working on selling an underlay for other standard systems like EPDM,TPO, and the like. It’ll be a harder sell, but if they’ll buy the one idea, I believe that in time we can sell them the other.”

That's exactly right. Most of us have a healthy streak of rebelliousness alive and well within us, but that streak weakens with age and you have to pick your fights.

The other thing about underlayments that concerns me is that (yes, we need to make a serious effort to conserve resources, but...) we have a whole army of people out there now who are devoting all their time to making buildings air-tight. They are now calculating exactly how much air exchange needs to be brought into the structures by mechanical means because nothing breathes anymore.

I don't care for it. It's not natural, it's not friendly, it's not healthy, and it's not sane. Let me say it more clearly: It is insane.

That's one of the main reasons I'm putting an emphasis on Deck Armor.

After all that is said and done, it, too, is synthetic. The world is filling up with plastic so why not live in a plastic baggy with an air hose to the outside world. My brother considers himself enlightened but he drinks "pure" water in plastic bottles. After the umpteenth time of politely turning down the offer of one, I had to get blunt and ask him what it was that he wasn't understanding. I told him "I don't drink water out of plastic... it's toxic. Thank you for the thought, but please don't offer me any more and please don't drink any more yourself. They are bad for you, especially when you let them heat up in the afternoon."

That's a valid point wywoody!

Why would you want to add it later?

The only rationale' I can muster, is possibly the roofer failed, and must therefore, rely on a waterproof membrane, rather than the primary roof covering?